[PhantomCBR]

ok i dont know if this is a repost but ive been reading other forums and the question came up how many people use the clutch to shift? well that went all indepth about when its done. But i was wondering if this is good for the tranny? or can they handel it? will it shorten teh life of the tranny? MSF says to use the clutch but i wana know the full story.
thanks

 

[Sully]

Someone can correct me if I'm wrong but I don't think it damages the tranny when shifting up with out the clutch, provided you're rpm's are up. As for shifting down I don't know.

 

[TeeTee]

There's a massive thread on this in the General section. Check it out.

I often shifted up without the clutch until about a year and a half ago when I was TOLD to downshift without it as well while at American Supercamp. And since it wasn't MY bike I went along with it. Turns out it's fine and I've been doing it often but not consistently with all my bikes.

The big deal is that if you get it right it's smooth and smooth is good. But if you do it wrong and it clunks, grinds or kicks out then you're wearing off a tiny bit of metal. Or if you force it with excessive boot pressure you then risk bending a shift fork. But done gently with good timing it's very, very smooth and no damage occurs.

It's actually quite easy. If you can shift now with the clutch try reducing the amount of clutch you use down to the point where you only pull on a bit of pressure just to reach the mid range of the friction point. If you are shifting smoothly at this clutch amount then you're fine to shift without any clutch. If you're getting clunks or jerks when you shift or you can feel the shift lever moving in bits and starts without being smooth then your timing is off and you need more clutched shift practice to get it right.

 

[coolio]

It's actually quite easy. If you can shift now with the clutch try reducing the amount of clutch you use down to the point where you only pull on a bit of pressure just to reach the mid range of the friction point. If you are shifting smoothly at this clutch amount then you're fine to shift without any clutch

I pull the clutch all the way in when I shift so to see if I can go clutchess I do what you said above (pull the clutch in till it reaches the mid range of the friction point)? I have been just so used to shifting like that and haven't bother changing my style. Is it gonna make difference if I go clutchless? Any advantages than that slight shifting time?

 

[TeeTee]

No advantage but if you find you can feel some roughness or hesitation to shift with the clutch semi pulled then you're not shifting right in the first place and it'll get worse if you try to go clutchless. When it's smooth as silk then you're ready to shift without using the clutch at all.

Remember too that the best shifts are the fast ones where all the actions of rolling off, clutch, shift, roll on happen as one "flick" of your body parts that all happen togehter with just a hair of difference in the timing so that it all happens in the right order. But to anyone watching it looks like you do it all at the same time and with one "flinch". If you're breaking up all the steps into separate parts you'll never get a smooth shift.

 

[coolio]

Thanks TeeTee, great explanation!

 

[mascu]

how do we shift without clutch...... i did it with a smaller bike before

but for some reason i tried today...... and it's not possible? stiff as a rock

honda cbr 600rr 06

kept pulling at it...... no luck

 

[lizard928s]

to shift to a higher gear with no clutch accelerate briskly get your foot under the shifter peg and apply light to moderate pressure upwards on the shifter peg, then release throttle to bring rpms down say 500-1000RPMS, and bike should upshift to higher gear,

to downshift without clutch press mildly on shifter peg and blip throttle up at same time to rev match. bike will shift, will take time to get this smooth.

 

[mascu]

wow kickass, gonna try that tmr

 

[Miguel]

I heart clutchless shifting when done properly. I've messed it a couple times though and wow it pisses my bike off, woops. My question, I usually do it around 7000-8000 rpm. What do you think about doing it higher, more around your red line? I try to avoid it... TeeTee, you're up.

 

[masonjarz]

I don't do it...I know that it doesn't do any damage but I just can't bring myself to do it (on purpose anyway).