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Discussion Starter #1
How can we worship the Rossi's of the world, yet flame immigrants?
How many leading MotoGP riders were born in the US or Canada?

There are good motorcyclists, (driver's), and bad motorcyclists (driver's).
That's it. That's all.
What country they were born in has no relevance.

Or does it?
I'm going to guess there are more people on this forum, whom are descendants of immigrants to this country, than not.
Your parents? Grandparents? Great Grandparents? Unless you're Haida, or Salish, I'm guessing you are an "immigrant," too, just like me. (parents emigrated in '52)

Motorcyclists, for the benefit of the sport, require a cohesive voice, not divisions. I'll admire any skilled motorcyclist, and hope the poor ones survive long enough to become skilled.
My $.02.
(flame suit zipping up)
 

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And what exactly is this referencing? Did I miss an argument?
 

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Trapped in Nutella shell
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Quick comment coming from an recently landed immigrant in Canada.
I think Canadians are by far the least racist people I have ever met, and the most welcoming for immigrants.
I've been in Vancouver/Canada for a little over a year now and I feel like it's home already.
I don't side with immigrants complaining of being mistreated by Canadians as most of them don't try hard enough to undertsand the local culture, are not flexible enough to play by the (canadian) rules.
Very happy to be here, but I'm now planning to move South as I think I'll be financilaly more successful there.
Almost totally OT comment :laughing

But yes I do think than Europeans are better driver/riders than Canadians :laughing
OMG what did I just write ??? :surrender
 

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Nutella said:
But yes I do think than Europeans are better driver/riders than Canadians :laughing
OMG what did I just write ??? :surrender
i challenge you to a game of Tourist Trophy, loser gets deported.:laughing
 

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I'm an immigrant. Emigrated when I was 12. I drive both a car and a motorcycle, I bought me some property and I would like to steal me a nice paying Canadian job too =).

No idea what sparked this thread either, but I wanted to ad my 2c since I can relate to it in some way. It's not a big deal to me, but kind of amuses me in a disturbing way. You wouldn't believe the number of times I've had people telling me about those damn immigrants doing this and doing that. I just look at them blankly and say... "yeah... sucks doesn't it... You know... I'm an immigrant". And then the response... "Oh.... I don't mean you.." or "You know what I mean..".

I don't really understand why immigrants get such a bad rap. Most of us are immigrants ourselves, or are decendants of immigrants. Do you really know what an immigrant looks like? No you don't. The comments I get are proof of that. Is it really the immigrants or are we just easy to target? As when you go to any country, there's a learning curve to language, culture, systems in general, way of life, mannerisms... etc. In my mind, I simply put it all down to this way of thinking coming from that.

Everyone has the right to their opinion and if it was your opinion, I'd hate for you to hold it back because of who I am. However, sometimes I just can't believe how people freely comment negatively, without much thought of the impact on others. Some people are more sensitive than others. These types of comments don't hurt me, but I do feel bad if someone is within ears reach who may be offended by such comments.

Ok, rant over. Flame away. =D
 

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Canadians are more accepting of other cultures because Canadian society, at least in our major cities intermingles immigrant cultures more than any other country I've visited. Most of the bigotry I've witnessed is found in areas where the bigots are isolated and have little to no interraction with the minority they profess to hate.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
And what exactly is this referencing? Did I miss an argument?
My apologies, I was merely reading through the:Motorcyclist Hit in North Vancouver
thread, and observed how it evolved into a quasi "anti immigrant motorcyclists" conversation.
I didn't want to hijack a thread out of respect for the deceased rider, evolved in such a manner.
 
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The truth is unless you're a North American Indian, we're all immigrants. Being born in Canada gives you no more rights than immigrating and becoming a Canadian. Don't for a minute thinks there are no racists in Canada, they are just very nice racists who will smile in your face then mumble a racist comment as you walk away. I do believe it is wrong for immigrants not to integrate with Canadian culture and language. I am sometimes perplexed by some who have been living in the country for 10-20 years and they are unable to communicate in a clear Canadian language. Reminds me of listening to the Fox and the DJ asking the contestent what nationality he is and he replies," Oh I'm white man" Duh
 

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Moved to Open because this has pretty much nothing to do with motorcycles.

I've got nothing against immigrants. Hell, my father was one and my mother's parents were too. The only folks that aren't immigrants are the natives.... and there's even evidence that they came over from the Mongolia region of asia way back when. So who cares.

What I am prejudiced towards is stupidity. The stupidity of drivers that should not be allowed behind a wheel and can barely manage to walk upright. The stupidity of the system that grants them licenses to drive. The stupidity of a system that fails to use ciminal punishment as a deterent towards not performing further criminal acts. The stupidity of people that think a person's skin color makes a difference. The stupidity of those that try to use their skin color to gain advantage. The stupidity of a system that tries to be politicallly correct to a degree that smacks of something out of Alice in Wonderland or the Emperor's New Clothes. The stupidity of..... well I could be here all day, couldn't I.... :D

We are all the same color inside and it's how we think and how we act that SHOULD define us. Honorable people that cooperate and strive for excellence in all their activities are capable of building great things. Those that turn their backs on any of these drag us down.
 

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Speaking to the stereo types against bad drivers from India and Asia,

I recently spent some time in India, China and Hong Kong. Being a motorsports minded kinda guy, I took an interests in observing driving/motorcycling styles. In my opinion, driving customs from other countries are less compatible for other countries.

India's driving style - chaos, a LOT less rules, go when you have a chance or someone else will. If another scooter/motorcycle bumps into you, just keep going cuz if you stop you're going to get run over! And it makes perfect sense to drive like that over in India. So if a you were to come to Canada with that mind set, you're probably going to cut alot of people off, run the odd red light or try to squeeze through impossibly close situations because it's normal back home.

China - I was in Beijing/Shanghai and traffic never really got a chance to get going at a really good clip. It's so crowded that you often just kinda crawl along. Cars aren't all that fast there either. There's never any need to be aware of letting people get ahead of you because everybody know's there's a traffic jam ahead. I wonder if this has anything to do with peaceful looking asian ladies driving 10 km's below the speedlimit here...again, it makes perfect sense there because everybody drives the same.

Hong Kong - I was too busy getting drunk in the wicked and wild party district to watch the driving. I do remember seeing more ferrari's, porsches, and other exotics in a month than I had ever seen before...
 

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Nutella said:
But yes I do think than Europeans are better driver/riders than Canadians :laughing
OMG what did I just write ??? :surrender
haha .. I agree. Canadians do have the one of the worse driving records in general than the Europeans according to some reports and articles I read back in college. I think the driving tests are more difficult to pass there. Although I have to say with the exception of Italy (sorry to any Italians). If you've been to Italy, you know that a red light doesn't mean stop.. .it means go if you want and if you don't go you're likely to get honked at along with a multitude of rude gestures. At least, that was my experience there. :p
 

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:laughing
I'd forgotten about the he/she.
 

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Funny that. I remember the womens Canadian mountain bike downhill champ was also a he to she. Same person?
 

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Trapped in Nutella shell
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i challenge you to a game of Tourist Trophy, loser gets deported
Suitcases are ready ! I'm rather below average driver and I've only started to explore 2nd gear top speed on the GS500. I'm scared to death. I think I should quit riding :laughing

I think that because of lack of space and cities built long ago, the driving environnment is much more challenging in Europe. Roads are narrow and winding, average speed much higher. Everyone drive manual transmission, and that alone requires you to anticipate what happens next and be more involved while driving.
I also think that Europeans drivers are more relaxed with the concept of "high speed". You're not considered a criminal if you are driving fast for as long as it is safe. Drivers will stick to the right lane on the highway and let you pass without looking at you like a criminal .
Worse I've seen people here blocking me intentionally so that I slow down as if driving fast= driving dangerously.
A lot of congestion would be avoided if we could drive a little faster.
Also, is running red lights a Vancouver pastime ? I had never seen that before WTF
So is not signaling, then norm here :firemad
 

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Canadians are more accepting of other cultures because Canadian society, at least in our major cities intermingles immigrant cultures more than any other country I've visited. Most of the bigotry I've witnessed is found in areas where the bigots are isolated and have little to no interraction with the minority they profess to hate.
I'd say there are no absolutes, but my experience is the exact reverse: The racists are the ones from the major metro centres like Toronto and Montreal. Look at the insanity of "distinct society", perhaps the most racist piece of public policy drivel to be put forward in western society since the late 1930's*. With a straight face, Quebec wanted a race based constiutional amendment. Worse, it was based on a nebulous basis, that being "Quebecois". They also asked for it via the Meech and Charlottetown amendments.

Without putting too fine a point on it, look at the policies and political movements that Quebec and Ontario, the more "urban" provinces have produced in the last century: Enforced Bilingualism, Distinct Society, a multicultural policy that is specific in stating that you can have your own culture as long as it doesn't conflict with the french or English Canadian traditions, "Masters in Our Own House", "Pure Wool"(Pur laine, a reference to maintaining the "racial purity" of Quebecois)and an honest to god police department that does nothing except ensure that people are using government approved speech.

Contrasting that, if you look at the western provinces and the political ideas that have come out, the reverse is true. Medicare rose out of the Prairie based CCF, the Reform concept that stated all persons and provinces should be treated as equals, the environmental movement and it's alliance with native groups among many others. Look at BC: We've had numerous Chinese and Indian politicians, including a Indian origin Premier. I'd also say that Wally Oppal has about a 50/50 chance of being the next one. In all honesty, what do think the chances of a non-European getting elected to that job in Ontario or, here's a giggle, Quebec?

The rural communities generally had less of a racist bent than the urban communities due to the equal footing with other immigrant groups: Everybody was new here, so it made for a more equal society.

*Heck, even in the 30's, the racists were from Toronto and Quebec: The largest Canadian Nazi Party rally was in Maple Leaf Gardens.
 

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Nutella said:
Quick comment coming from an recently landed immigrant in Canada.
I think Canadians are by far the least racist people I have ever met, and the most welcoming for immigrants.
I've been in Vancouver/Canada for a little over a year now and I feel like it's home already.
I don't side with immigrants complaining of being mistreated by Canadians as most of them don't try hard enough to undertsand the local culture, are not flexible enough to play by the (canadian) rules.
Very happy to be here, but I'm now planning to move South as I think I'll be financilaly more successful there.
Almost totally OT comment :laughing

But yes I do think than Europeans are better driver/riders than Canadians :laughing
OMG what did I just write ??? :surrender
It's because you're white, if you were a visible minority you may have had a harder time feeling at home.
Chances are if you cut off someone in traffic no one is going to yell"fucking immigrant!" out at you.
 
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while it doesnt matter the color of skin, when i look at statistics i see a large number of vehicle accidents (not just motorcycle) involving asian peoples. i dont know if theyre students, but i do see the cars theyre driving. just like a newbie rider shouldnt get onto a litre bike, a newbie driver shouldnt step into a V8 car or similar equivilent. but these are the vehicles these peoples are driving. how many civics are totalled because of reckless (aka stupid) driving? im not trying to say one race is smarter than the next, but look at the streets. inorder to attend school here out of country students have to have money. when mom and dad buy them a hopped up car, its a recipe for disaster.

i can be vehiclist too. next time youre on the Coq in winter count the vehicles in the ditch. notice how many are ford explorers. in 4 trips between myself and my cousin, we witnessed 14 explorers in the ditch. considering the number of other SUV's on the road, the explorer is the ditch favorite. there were 3 other SUV's and 2 compact SUV's (tracker, and TJ/YJ). my favorite was the one i witnessed happening in my rear view mirror. brand new F150 loaded to the nuts. happened no more than 1km from the toll plaza. good times, good times.

i didnt always see people, but the new F150 was a big burley texan dude. he had the accent, i dunno if he was texan or not. id guess most were families, prolly just pushin too hard to get home in record time in lousy conditions, cuz they have 4x4!
 

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Tattoodles said:
Canadians are more accepting of other cultures because Canadian society, at least in our major cities intermingles immigrant cultures more than any other country I've visited. Most of the bigotry I've witnessed is found in areas where the bigots are isolated and have little to no interraction with the minority they profess to hate.

WRONG.

Did you ever consider that the "bigots"(as you call them) live outside the cities because they were driven out by an influx of imigrants?
The city that my wife and I grew up in our whole life is now so overun with imigrants that our son was the only caucasion in his class and one of six in the entire school. When he played on the playground, he was the only kid speaking english. I've got nothing against intermingling cultures, thats a good thing, but in my opinion is it's getting out of hand when its no longer imigration and becomes an invasion.
 
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