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How to ride
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A question for the racer dudes here, or anyone else. A discussion on another thread leading to talk about thumb brakes made me wonder why reverse shifting or GP shifting isn't standard on most sport bikes.

I understand it is tough to use the right foot for braking at deep right lean angles, just as it is tough to get your toe under the shifter coming out of a deep left turn. So why aren't all real sportbikes coming from the factory race ready with reverse shifting? (1 up, 5 down)
 

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I think it just has to do with history... the fact that bikes have always been sold with a 1 down and up shift pattern. It would be confusing to most consumers to trade in one bike for another and have a totally different shift pattern. Just my guess.
 

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other than like the hp4 race what comes race ready?

.01% of 'real sportbikes' dont need it.. so kinda pointless.
 

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license to chill
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I would say safety. I'm sure regulations demand making it easier to slow down than to speed up, and that includes downshifting.
 

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I would say safety. I'm sure regulations demand making it easier to slow down than to speed up, and that includes downshifting.
For 99.9% of folk it makes no difference.. it's about familiarity. Bikes have always been one down, and gears up.
 

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other than like the hp4 race what comes race ready?

.01% of 'real sportbikes' dont need it.. so kinda pointless.
None. I don't see many bikes that come fully fitted with race fairings to go. It's not the target market... it's race fans, whom
are used to a 1 down 5 up gearing. They would be fucked going the other way, most folks would be shifting the wrong way.
 

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Well, reverse shifting's benefit is not just in corners, it allows for quicker upshifts in teh straight sections as well. I've used both, and I actually prefer the reverse pattern. But on the street.......no difference
 

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Katani Kalan
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None. I don't see many bikes that come fully fitted with race fairings to go. It's not the target market... it's race fans, whom
are used to a 1 down 5 up gearing. They would be fucked going the other way, most folks would be shifting the wrong way.
I was at the Ridge this summer and a guy went full bore into turn one from the pits and blew the corner. First time on with GP Shift and he went the wrong way and went flying !! It's not for everyone and I personally don't have it either.
 

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I think it just has to do with history... the fact that bikes have always been sold with a 1 down and up shift pattern.
Motorcycle companies had all kinds of oddball shifting. Leaving out tank shifts, some of the Euros had RH shifts and 1 up/3 or 4 down for the longest time. I believe it was 1975 when it was mandated by whoever that shifting would forevermore be done with the left foot in the 1 dwn,the rest up manner.

There have only been a few times in my riding when I wished for a GP pattern ....... as in 3 or 4 shifts over 30+ yrs of riding. Without a doubt I would totally screw it up within the few few blocks.
 

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track hack
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Well, reverse shifting's benefit is not just in corners, it allows for quicker upshifts in teh straight sections as well. I've used both, and I actually prefer the reverse pattern. But on the street.......no difference
Um, how is that exactly?

Same ignition cut time, same distance between gears - I guess you assume you can push down faster than you can pull up?

I've had race bikes with GP shift and standard street pattern - initially switching over was a challenge as I had to divert a lot of brain power to reminding myself "head up, pull up, head down, push down" over and over and not doing the usual things like looking for reference points, judging closing speeds, etc... After 1-2 full race weekends though it was getting more and more comfortable and intuitive.

For a low level Club racer like I was, the benefits were negligible at best - impossible to substantiate any real improvements in laptimes and there was only 1 corner/gearing combo at The Ridge that GP helped by not having to lift the bike up and shift.
 

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body positioning works much better with reverse shifting... you don't need to reposition yourself as much
trying to 'not upset the chassis'.. and its much easier to slap down with your foot rather than pull up.

yes reverse shifting is much more effective, simpler and end result is quicker shifting.. no need to get technical about it


I still find it more than a little funny when I hear somebody say it took them a while to figure it out because they had to divert brain power in the process..

seriously? I cant even imagine that... took a mere couple rides around the block to get with it.

crappy part is when you're in the thick of traffic, go for the pass and half way realize you just geared up instead of down in search for more torque. WOOOPS!! :laughing
 

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track hack
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I still find it more than a little funny when I hear somebody say it took them a while to figure it out because they had to divert brain power in the process..

seriously? I cant even imagine that... took a mere couple rides around the block to get with it.
Just checking - you're referring to doing this while racing at 10/10th's and just a couple seconds off of lap record pace correct?

Just checking to make sure we're talking apples to apples here. I didn't sleep at Holiday Inn last night so I'm not the smartest apple on the tree so you'll have to keep it simple for us low brain power types.
 

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don't see how it makes a difference.. unless your brain suddenly goes into 'chimp mode' under pressure..

personally never found it to be that big a deal, actually felt a heck of a lot more natural..

i thought you track day types were supposed to be super-human? I've never stayed at a holiday-inn express though.. :coffee
 

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Fastronaut
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What's easier? Shoving your hoof into the ground or picking it up?

Don't those things have paddle shifters yet?
 

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track hack
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don't see how it makes a difference.. unless your brain suddenly goes into 'chimp mode' under pressure..

personally never found it to be that big a deal, actually felt a heck of a lot more natural..

i thought you track day types were supposed to be super-human? I've never stayed at a holiday-inn express though.. :coffee
So by this reasoning you have the exact same reaction time to make decisions travelling solo on a highway at 100kph as you do on a track, in close quarters with others, at speeds over 270kph? For you there's no difference huh? No big deal, you can hit those braking markers, avoid that racer trying to slide up the inside of you, drop 3 gears (by pulling up remember), nail the apex, oh-check again for that guy on your heels, then grab a couple gears again (push down). All that after 20 years of doing it the complete opposite way. If that's the case I gotta buy myself a cruiser like yours and pay you for some lessons because clearly you have this shit figured out better than anyone else.
 

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so by this reasoning you have the exact same reaction time to make decisions travelling solo on a highway at 100kph as you do on a track, in close quarters with others, at speeds over 270kph? For you there's no difference huh? No big deal, you can hit those braking markers, avoid that racer trying to slide up the inside of you, drop 3 gears (by pulling up remember), nail the apex, oh-check again for that guy on your heels, then grab a couple gears again (push down). All that after 20 years of doing it the complete opposite way. If that's the case i gotta buy myself a cruiser like yours and pay you for some lessons because clearly you have this shit figured out better than anyone else.
oh snap!
 

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How to ride
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Discussion Starter #18
Some good feedback here. If I ever had a track day on a bike set up with reverse shift - I'd hope it was also equipped with a slipper clutch for when I get it totally wrong.
 

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I was just thinking. It's best application might be on a bait bike. Watch the perpetrator take off in second gear, get up to speed then shift into
what they think is second - only to have tachometer go to the moon as it his first. Best without a slipper clutch for the locked wheel effect.

Bet that bike gets left behind in a hurry.
 
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