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Hates drama...
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1,916 Posts
Porsche77 - chances are slim that someone else is going to volunteer to critique your style, unless you actually tell them something like "Hey, mind if I lead for a while? I'd like you to give me some pointers". Which, now that I think of it is a really good idea for new riders to do.
+1 :rockon

For this to happen, the newb ego has to be checked at the door though. We want you to have year after year of riding and not just a month or two...
 

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Proud Chicken Strip Owner
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51 Posts
This really gave me a good idea of what you guys must really go through with new riders (Myself included). I can only imagine how many puffed out chested idiots starting out with 600cc bikes attempting to get at the front of the group thinking this whole thing is a competition (Or something even more stupid, a race). Thank you for posting this. I have a more accurate idea of how tough you guys really have it out there, and how not to make things more worse once i get to the point of group riding.
 

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Foreign Devil
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1,794 Posts
This really gave me a good idea of what you guys must really go through with new riders (Myself included). I can only imagine how many puffed out chested idiots starting out with 600cc bikes attempting to get at the front of the group thinking this whole thing is a competition (Or something even more stupid, a race). Thank you for posting this. I have a more accurate idea of how tough you guys really have it out there, and how not to make things more worse once i get to the point of group riding.
Leading a group is daunting at best. Trying to get a feel of the riders behind you without going too fast or too slow, while trying to keep everybody from getting lost or even worse, hurt.
If you want to do a bit of leading, start with a real small group, maybe 3 or 4. Get an experienced leader to follow behind you so they can still control the group behind them, while watching out for you at the same time.
And yes, it is hard to figure out speeds etc.... when I lead a 'newbie' ride I generally turn it down to about 70% of normal, but guess what? Even that can be too much for some... when I go around a corner with my wife on the back and get through no problem, then see in my mirror the rider directly behind me (solo and on a smaller, lighter, nimbler bike) highside or disappear over the edge of the road...well, I have to really wonder what the skill level is and why they couldn't make it around what is to me, an easy corner.
Part of a group ride is being able to turn off what the guy in front of you is doing and make sure you are in your zone.
Push a little bit so you can grow, but it's still your zone you gotta push, don't try to get into my zone cause you most likely won't make it. (NOT trying to sound high and mighty here...!!!)
Most of the experienced riders started out on small bikes and gradually worked up to 600's or litre bikes. I rode for about 20 years on a 400. I still find it hard to believe that a brand new rider would choose a 600 for their first bike.
So, please be careful out there, I HATE it when I have to turn around cause somebody decided to go off-road exploring!
AND, watch this video:

22897515
 

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Has no use for liars!
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163 Posts
It took me a day to get through this thread but coming from a newb...it holds such great information!! This will really make you think twice about your riding ability especially if you are a new rider! Take it slow and take it easy when your just starting out...the temptation will always be there to go faster, but don't become a statistic!! Ride within your ability, if your buddies ahead of you can't understand that ...find other people to ride with. Your life is not worth the risk!! Whats the big rush anyways, I always wonder??? The reward to life is living and getting to your destination in one piece with a smile on your face and memories in your mind! Speeding to keep up with your mates will only get you killed, are they worth that risk? Slow and steady wins the race....:rider
 

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Registered
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794 Posts
I'd like to re-iterate one point - the MOST important things I've learned, the things that have stuck with me the most in my 10 years of riding, is what I've heard other more experienced riders say. Tips on cornering, gear, maintenance, how they dealt with unexpected circumstances, and most importantly, what they did wrong. These things have saved my life. When I hit a deer last year, I stayed up. Instead of trying to avoid it, I got on the brakes and kept the bike upright and straight. We hit the deer, there a big mess of fur and some broken plastic. But that's it. During the whole incident there was the voice of a guy I talked to 5 years ago who hit a deer, only he tried to avoid it, so when he hit the deer he was leaned over and skidding, and ended up high siding into the ditch. Bike totaled, him and his passenger in the hospital, and he didn't ride again for 2 years. I caught by breath, let the adrenaline drain away, kissed my g/f, and continued riding.

As a newb, you should be a sponge absorbing everything you hear, sorting out the valuable information and keeping those for future use. It's served me well.
 

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Smile. :)
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1,145 Posts
This really gave me a good idea of what you guys must really go through with new riders (Myself included). I can only imagine how many puffed out chested idiots starting out with 600cc bikes attempting to get at the front of the group thinking this whole thing is a competition (Or something even more stupid, a race). Thank you for posting this. I have a more accurate idea of how tough you guys really have it out there, and how not to make things more worse once i get to the point of group riding.
Oh this brings back memories... A long while ago when doing the YVR airport loop a guy on a 99-00 year Yahama R6 binned it right in front of me and almost took out the two other riders ahead of him. A new rider with only a week experience who decided that it was "cool" to go with the faster group with no real idea of what was really going to happen.
I don't think I've read up on anyone crashing and taking out another rider(s) but it can happen.
You can only judge so much skill level a person has based on a persons additude, appearance and ect. I prefer CDG's plan of point x to point x and that works really well.
I want rhubarb pie now. :D
 

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Registered
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Of all the "rhubarbs" I have seen, there is a very common denominator.

Usually it's an inexperienced city slicker who shows up on a backroad ride. They have little understanding of what a backroad is,
and they proceed to ride off the shoulder in a tight turn (to them) and wad their stuff up.

It's very predictable to be honest. Almost sad.
 

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Foreign Devil
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1,794 Posts
Of all the "rhubarbs" I have seen, there is a very common denominator.

Usually it's an inexperienced city slicker who shows up on a backroad ride. They have little understanding of what a backroad is,
and they proceed to ride off the shoulder in a tight turn (to them) and wad their stuff up.

It's very predictable to be honest. Almost sad.
Yup. Seen that happen more than once. Show up late for the ride, miss the pre-brief / safety speech, rush to catch up to the group and find yourself in over your head...and wake up in the bushes.

But, it seems like this will never change. Look at how many threads and posts there are, and how many times the more experienced riders have told others 'stay within your limits' to no avail.

I almost just wanna give up and let them crash. Less bikes to worry about then...but, that's wrong.

We have to keep on trying to lead by example and hope beyond all hopes that someday, maybe, just maybe, one of them will listen and have a good ride.
 

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backslider
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11,214 Posts
Of all the "rhubarbs" I have seen, there is a very common denominator.

Usually it's an inexperienced city slicker who shows up on a backroad ride. They have little understanding of what a backroad is,
and they proceed to ride off the shoulder in a tight turn (to them) and wad their stuff up.

It's very predictable to be honest. Almost humorous.
fix-ed
 

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backslider
Joined
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11,214 Posts
Somebody told me today, that on a recent ride Mr. Frito Bandito pulled over, instructed the newb to wait there for four minutes, and only then commence riding again .... as that way there's no way they'll try to keep up.

Brilliant - the only solution!
 

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The Silver Power Ranger
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237 Posts
I'm a new rider, but I was taught smart and born evil... I got to hand it to my instructor Dat who taught me it was smart to be evil on the road, so naturally I could just be myself. Hell I'm the last person to ever want to be in the front of a pack, let somebody else be the decoy, if you live I'll follow. I'm here to ride, if you get fucked up by a car pulling out, that's too bad, hopefully I have enough time to avoid it or break... shits just down right evil, I know, but let the guy with the ego go first. best lesson i've ever learned.
 

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backslider
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11,214 Posts
I'm a new rider, but I was taught smart and born evil... I got to hand it to my instructor Dat who taught me it was smart to be evil on the road, so naturally I could just be myself. Hell I'm the last person to ever want to be in the front of a pack, let somebody else be the decoy, if you live I'll follow. I'm here to ride, if you get fucked up by a car pulling out, that's too bad, hopefully I have enough time to avoid it or break... shits just down right evil, I know, but let the guy with the ego go first. best lesson i've ever learned.
But it's the fact that people (newbs) try to keep up with more experienced/faster riders that's the point herein ... not whether a rider goes first or not ...
 

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Registered Luser
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well, technically speaking, can't a newb on a modern sportbike match a faster rider through a corner if he commits to the same line and lean angle? of course this is generally speaking, and assuming the faster/more experienced leader has left some margin of safety beyond hanging off and backing it in etc.
 

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This space for rent
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well, technically speaking, can't a newb on a modern sportbike match a faster rider through a corner if he commits to the same line and lean angle? of course this is generally speaking, and assuming the faster/more experienced leader has left some margin of safety beyond hanging off and backing it in etc.
Can't decide if this question is so ridiculous because you're a newb (and therefore, forgiven) or because you don't remember the newb phase ( and should stop leaving such bad advice for the newbs).

Technically speaking, if my aunt was a dude, she'd be my uncle. But she's not. If a newb could match lean angle and line of a faster experienced rider, every time, without crashing, then the newb rider is probably not a newb rider anymore.

See pg 1: "Don't ride with the fast group and try to keep up"
 

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Super Moderator
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Can't decide if this question is so ridiculous because you're a newb (and therefore, forgiven) or because you don't remember the newb phase ( and should stop leaving such bad advice for the newbs).
Agreed......I mean, lean angle and line, it gets made to sound so simplistic.....it's not a
matter of "just doing it", it's a matter of being capable to even get close to matching it.

"Lean angle" and "line" have absolutely no direct relation to speed, or even each other for that matter.
 

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The Silver Power Ranger
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237 Posts
But it's the fact that people (newbs) try to keep up with more experienced/faster riders that's the point herein ... not whether a rider goes first or not ...
I see, so the new guys that show up don't ride in their groove, they try to follow you and they crash... well that's just stupid, being new doesn't have anything to do with it. they could be 10 years in to riding, and if they followed the same pattern of behaviour with an even better rider, you'll get the same out come, another idiot in a ditch.
 

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Registered Luser
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Can't decide if this question is so ridiculous because you're a newb (and therefore, forgiven) or because you don't remember the newb phase ( and should stop leaving such bad advice for the newbs).
i'm half being an argumentative ass, and half serious, as I still consider myself a newb, and i am definitely at my fastest following one of you jerks through the corners. This is because I am otherwise too conservative with my corner entry speed.

Agreed......I mean, lean angle and line, it gets made to sound so simplistic.....it's not a
matter of "just doing it", it's a matter of being capable to even get close to matching it.

"Lean angle" and "line" have absolutely no direct relation to speed, or even each other for that matter.
please explain. as my limited understanding of physics tells me that lean angle and line are the the basic determining factors of how fast a single track vehicle can negotiate a given arc of roadway if traction remains a constant (as with two equal bikes on equal tires).
 
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