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you are somewhat correct of course as far as how the two styles of bikes are used. It was meant as a snarky remark knowing the answer, I wouldnt have asked if it was Bandito posting :coffee

1st rule of being an asshole online, know your audience :cool

at the end of the day though, suspension and damping adjustments are very similar, and what actually makes up the suspension components is exactly the same across the board.

point is, I've been at this for a fvcking long time, competed for Trials 6 years and ridden several different Trials, Cruisers, sportbikes alike.. Suspension is suspension.

guess what the 1st thing i found when i rode cruisers? front end feel is lacking when compared to a sportbike. imagine that? i figured it all out by myself and didnt need a track..
But what it lacks in front wheel handling feel it must make up for in front braking, right? ;)

I'm not debating that the mechanical side of how suspension is designed or shared among different platforms, just
feel that they way it's used in application, on the bike, and how it's set up, could not be any different of a comparo.
 

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:popcorn:popcorn I'm just here to watch comparisons of a Trials bike suspension to a sport bikes suspension. Let's see, long throw, bouncy, absorbent as all fuck as you jump rocks, rails, platforms, etc. Yup. Sounds like typical sportbike stuff.

LOL! Not even fucking close. It's like comparing a BMX to a mountain bike. This is entertaining! BTW, I'm laughing AT you, not with you.
 

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Fastronaut
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Dunno, the Aussie must be pretty ace to get enough seat time to rate the bike prior to the press launch.

Doohan? Stoner? What's Gobert doing these days?
 

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Dunno, the Aussie must be pretty ace to get enough seat time to rate the bike prior to the press launch.

Doohan? Stoner? What's Gobert doing these days?
actually what i said is IF it is anything like the R1M, here is this: blah. so no not specifically describing the new Honda.. I figured that was obvious enough.

:popcorn:popcorn I'm just here to watch comparisons of a Trials bike suspension to a sport bikes suspension. Let's see, long throw, bouncy, absorbent as all fuck as you jump rocks, rails, platforms, etc. Yup. Sounds like typical sportbike stuff.
thanks, you just caught on why i posted such a question.. you're right in terms of what we are discussing they're two completely unrelated subjects, or types of bikes.

as i mentioned, i was being an arse. direct response to being told to hit the track for the umpteenth time. I know CDG does not ride Trials, but keep laughing i'm glad i could help.

to be fair though i figured some one would bring it up, but no the Trials bikes I rode and competed with were not at all that bouncy as todays versions, neither were they nearly as bloody light. i wish.
Front end response, though obviously not nearly as stiff as on a sportbike was still very important indeed. The kind of terrain we would maneuver through required it so you dont land flat on your face.

I spent a shitload more time doing endoes in tight situations and getting around obstacles thats for sure.

feel that they way it's used in application, on the bike, and how it's set up, could not be any different of a comparo.
agreed of course, as should be pretty obvious.

main point was only that there are many other ways to learn how suspension works and its merits if you have experience in several different types of bikes.

you dont have to be a track day junky to learn what you like, dont like and what works / doesnt. You do the same on any type of bike really.

it didnt take long at all to understand what subtle changes made and how they improved my own bike when I tweaked the setup, and yet i'm just some schmuck from Trials.

The one area where an semi-active damping system would be great though is when you can match it on GPS per corner so you can run ideal damping curves as per required for a specific track..

that is very cool and would be incredibly useful i'm sure..
 

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Fastronaut
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actually what i said is IF it is anything like the R1M, here is this: blah. so no not specifically describing the new Honda.. I figured that was obvious enough..

Sorry I thought you had watched the video and digested how the setup was done. I guess you didn't watch it.

I have it on good account from a mate of mine down under, he's owned many bikes and he was not all that impressed.
This threw me a bit too.I've owned many bikes too but I don't thing it qualifies me to dismiss out of hand a brand new model I've never owned or even ridden.

Someday I guess I'll be an expert. Just not today.
 

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i'm fvcking (lol bachus, just say fucking for the sake of cocksucking fuck) loving this. the guardians of bcsb who booted all the malefactors jumping all over a dude for some inane comment about some asinine topic. winwinwin. we even got a early 2000's era facepalm reference in there.

for the love of god, bring back the death threats...
 

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i'm fvcking (lol bachus, just say fucking for the sake of cocksucking fuck) loving this.

for the love of god, bring back the death threats...

fUcking, feel better? :laughing


the real funny bit is most on here entirely missed the facepalm reference.. you could say it zoomed right over their pretty little heads..

but i agree, it seems everybody's beaten up to a pulp by the winter blues that any little comment will set them off; apparently i'm here to help :coffee

This threw me a bit too.I've owned many bikes too but I don't thing it qualifies me to dismiss out of hand a brand new model I've never owned or even ridden.
i knew it would confuse some but it was only meant as an offhand remark at the time. We can safely say bcsb has a track~proven record of blowing things entirely out of proportion.. :flip

yes i watched the video but skipped to what appeared to be the major points, only to confirm what has already been talked about with other riding mates..

The CBR1000RR SP has received a vast array of improvements, including some that come straight from the RC213V-S. Electronics play a big role, including semi-activeÖhlins Electronic Control suspension (S-EC)

as far as I have been told in recent past, it is a very similar system to what has been coming out in some form or another on the Multistrada 1200, Panigale 1299 (s?), BMW K 1200 S, Yamaha R1M, Kawi ZX10r (going back to '13?)

so unless Ohlins has radically over-night completely revised the system and yet the entire motorcycle magazine world missed it, I figured I was within safe boundaries to post what I did..

My Aussie mate is not the only one to make similar comments, in fact a very good friend of mine who works on
a shit-tonne of bike's suspension both for street & track has echoed same thoughts after having ridden the R1M at the track..


disclaimer: I am trained as an Electronics engineer and even I dont jump around like a little schoolgirl when the latest and greatest gizmoes come out trying to revolutionize our beloved sport.
 

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Fastronaut
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yes i watched the video but skipped to what appeared to be the major points, only to confirm what has already been talked about with other riding mates..

The CBR1000RR SP has received a vast array of improvements, including some that come straight from the RC213V-S. Electronics play a big role, including semi-activeÖhlins Electronic Control suspension (S-EC)

as far as I have been told in recent past, it is a very similar system to what has been coming out in some form or another on the Multistrada 1200, Panigale 1299 (s?), BMW K 1200 S, Yamaha R1M, Kawi ZX10r (going back to '13?)

so unless Ohlins has radically over-night completely revised the system and yet the entire motorcycle magazine world missed it, I figured I was within safe boundaries to post what I did..

My Aussie mate is not the only one to make similar comments, in fact a very good friend of mine who works on
a shit-tonne of bike's suspension both for street & track has echoed same thoughts after having ridden the R1M at the track..


disclaimer: I am trained as an Electronics engineer and even I dont jump around like a little schoolgirl when the latest and greatest gizmoes come out trying to revolutionize our beloved sport.

OK so you missed the entire point that there is a new way of setting up the suspension aimed directly at a rider who's not fluent in 3 clicks C slow speed 4 clicks R high speed.

Nothing to do the the active suspension.

Reminds me of this movie.

That's what I love about these 09 R1s, man. I get older, they stay the same age.
Time & tech does march on and to continually reference some decades old bike as the reason why a new one can't be very good just makes you sound like a crank.
 

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Time & tech does march on and to continually reference some decades old bike as the reason why a new one can't be very good just makes you sound like a crank.
i have no idea what you're going on about with this, nor what movie you're taking about.. online you get to choose how others sound, i have no control over this. :alien

yes i saw the bit where they're talking about to make things easier for those who just dont get it.. but again its got absolutely nothing to do with what i'm talking about..
those are just quick access methods, onscreen and little to do with whats going on inside, which is why i just kinda moved along.

my comments were specifically aimed at the fact its just little motors inside making the adjustments for you. Specifically regarding the semi-active component and its vague front end response in cornering when its active.

that is it, end of comment. done!.. now in terms of making things easier for the rider I believe BMW's method goes a step further with ride modes you can select, sport, touring & two-up or some variance of that, so dont quote me...

I have personally found it very easy to figure out required adjustments to get what i want out of my own bike, that was 3 years ago.. It is set now and have never found a need to make adjustments, much less on the fly.

its purely a personal preference i guess, i know how to use a screw driver or allen key.. I apologize if my comments somehow offend those who just want a zero learning curve, its never been my style.
I've mentioned before there are several review magazines which post recommended settings every year, from there it literally its as easy as one click that way, one click back.. really its not that complicated.
 

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Dazed and Confused .....
uhm, and how that relates to talking about clicks and suspension response, i have no idea..

thanks aguess, i do remember that line though..

you will find most technicians care very little about labels, which is what the whole push a button on a screen thing sounds like to me.. just another way to dummy it down.

i guess i can see how it looks if you dont know me, its not that i'm against it all i just like to be a little more hands on.
 

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Fastronaut
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uhm, and how that relates to talking about clicks and suspension response, i have no idea..

thanks aguess, i do remember that line though..

you will find most technicians care very little about labels, which is what the whole push a button on a screen thing sounds like to me.. just another way to dummy it down.

i guess i can see how it looks if you dont know me, its not that i'm against it all i just like to be a little more hands on.
Well the point of this thread is folks who don't "get" suspension. Not techs.

I know that when I'm teaching someone I don't go explain how since I understand it things will be simple. It's just like that and most people don't posses innate mechanical ability. In fact it's almost the opposite!

I came to bikes when it was all hands on and analog. No logging in to remap the fueling, No hit the search button on your phone to fine that bit of knowledge you're lacking. I got to watch the bikes change and in some case like FI become massively easier to work on and other cases maybe all those improvements become too complex to deal with.

The genie is never going back in the bottle for tech. So the idea that a rider can setup their ride based on seat of their pants feel and simple commands is very appealing. Not everyone is able to get out the wrenches and other tools to setup or take the time to test each small change and document it in writing while they're setting up the bike.

And as for active suspension it was banned when it first launched because it was that much better than the state of the art. It's only going to get better and in cases where it's giving some riders feedback they don't like I suspect it'll be very easy to tune that out. Just like logging in and either building a map for the fueling or downloading a pre-existing one that suits your setup.
 

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Well the point of this thread is folks who don't "get" suspension. Not techs.

And as for active suspension it was banned when it first launched because it was that much better than the state of the art. It's only going to get better and in cases where it's giving some riders feedback they don't like I suspect it'll be very easy to tune that out. Just like logging in and either building a map for the fueling or downloading a pre-existing one that suits your setup.
True enough, and i get thats why everybody wants a quick zero learning curve approach, its just not what i'm into at all. I am not an expert on any of this by far
but i've been curious enough to search for information and I was actually surprised at how much of it is available. I dont mind talking to those in the know.

What I see with all this new tech (and you're right we're stuck with it now) is just a little funny to see posts like the above from folks who would rather spend
over 20k hard earned CAD just so they can push a button, thinking thats gonna make all the difference in the world. Yet as this very thread proves they would
not spend 50 bucks to have a professional spend half an hour on their current bike to do the exact same :laughing

I have held back from posting most of what has been discussed on other forums purely (because information overload), and I agree when they 1st launched it
on the (07/08 SBK R1?) it was an unfair advantage. Now what most people dont understand is with their computers and GPS enabled sensors they were able
to set a specific damping curve/setting to a specific corner, lean angle of the bike etc. The system and its complexity is beyond what you can market today
and in reality it would not help the street rider at all unless you were planning on mapping out every damn corner from here to Osoyoos and back on multiple roads.

I hope you realize why I find the thought more than a little funny, specially on this forum where most of us are mere posers. AND y'all made fun of me and my laptop :rolleyes :cool

BUT the only way the damping is adjusted as you're riding mid-corner to mid-corner is via the semi-active component which if you understand how damping
curves and bike geometry behavior works, adjusting that damping curve on the fly IS what causes said (non confidence inspiring) vague response.

IT is still very cool but in the end at least in this generation of bikes it will do little but provide false confidence to a rider who wants nothing
to do with a little reading on how to set suspension properly. but thats just my 2 cents.
 

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Well we'll have to see.

Might have to get a new bike to see this for myself.
:laughing

the thought did cross my mind as well. I am actually glad to see Yamaha is continuing to release the R1M every year.

I do have a friend in California who owns one and its been a while since we talked. I know he did a 'fork internals' upgrade before taking it to the track
to better match his weight and valving needs but I dont know if it helped the little issue. He did notice it when he 1st rode the bike on the street.
 
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